20250726 USH India Meeting Transcript

This page contains the full transcript of the USH India Webinar held on 26 July 2025.

Title: "Learning Braille by Teresa Antony | USH India Webinar"

Youtube link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhSMSv07IQk

YOUTUBE VIDEO DESCRIPTION

This video shows the presentation of Teresa Antony at the USH India Meeting on the 26th of July 2025.

ACCESSIBILITY: *Both ASL and ISL interpretation are available in the video. *English captions are available in the video. *For our braille device users, the full transcript is available in https://ushindia.blogspot.com/p/20250726-ush-india-meeting-transcript.html *For Hindi speakers, a Hindi translation of the full transcript is available in https://ushindia.blogspot.com/p/20250726-ush-india-meeting-transcript-hindi.html TOPIC DESCRIPTION: This is a Q&A session with *Teresa Antony from Chetana Trust* (https://www.chetana.org.in/) — an expert in accessible and inclusive learning! Teresa is the Lead Illustrator and Designer of Accessible and Inclusive Books at Chetana Trust. We discussed questions like: *Do I really need to learn Braille? *What if there are no Braille trainers nearby? *How do I start learning Braille? *How can I introduce Braille to my child in a fun way? *What are some easy steps to build Braille skills over time? *Should I get a Braille slate and stylus right away? *Why Learn Braille Early? * For individuals with Usher syndrome, vision loss often progresses gradually, and while it's uncertain when or whether Braille will become essential, learning it early can offer lifelong benefits — both practical and emotional. *1. Builds Confidence and Reduces Future Stress* Learning Braille at a relaxed pace — especially before it's urgently needed — removes the pressure of having to learn it in crisis. It becomes a gradual, normal part of life, not a reaction to vision loss. *2. Keeps Educational Doors Open* Even if a child still uses print now, Braille can ensure continued independence in learning as vision changes. It’s a long-term investment in academic access and success. *3. More Options, More Freedom* Being Braille-literate gives individuals choice: they can read with sight while they can, switch to tactile reading later, or use a combination. It’s not about replacing print, but adding flexibility. *4. Makes Future Tech Use Easier* From Braille displays to screen readers and refreshable e-book devices, tech is more accessible and powerful with Braille knowledge. Kids and adults who already know Braille adapt much faster when they start using assistive tech. *5. Normalizes It Early* If a child learns Braille young — even sight-reading Braille visually — it becomes a normal part of their toolkit, not something “only for blind people.” This reduces stigma and builds identity and resilience. *A Message to Parents* If your child has Usher syndrome, consider introducing Braille early, gently, and positively. It’s not admitting defeat — it’s giving your child more tools, more power, and more independence. Even if they never need to rely on it fully, knowing Braille is never wasted — it’s a form of literacy that travels with them, wherever life goes. *Fun Tools for Learning Braille* Chetana Trust is developing a Braille Learning Kit filled with fun activities to make learning enjoyable and effective. They recently launched the book Sight Reading Braille Alphabets (https://www.instagram.com/reel/DLjz_Xgzqc4/) —which introduces letters gradually through engaging exercises like Word Matches, Coloring Pages, Puzzles, other bite-sized activities. Unlike many traditional Braille resources that focus only on memorization, this approach makes learning interactive and easier to retain. To order this book, contact team@chetana.org.in CONNECT WITH US: For more information about Usher Syndrome and the Usher Syndrome Coalition: Visit https://www.usher-syndrome.org http://www.youtube.com/@UsherCoalition Connect with the Usher Syndrome India (USH India) Community: Email: info.india@usher-syndrome.org USH India Blog: https://ushindia.blogspot.com Facebook Page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/ushersyndromeindia YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/@ushersyndromeindia2020 You are not alone!

FULL TRANSCRIPT

[Geri speaking]

All right. Here we go. So, good evening, everyone. This is Geri. I am one of the ambassadors of USH India. USH India is the India chapter of the Usher Syndrome Coalition. We also have with us another ambassador. Divya Goel. By the way, my sign name is I point to my eyeglasses, and I make. The letter G, I-S-L letter G. All right? All right.

So, this meeting, we're going to have two parts. The first part. We will have we will be talking about braille, and what's a fun way to start learning braille. In the second part, we will have a Q&A session with our some of our new members, to give them an opportunity to familiarize themselves with this group and ask their questions.

Although this group is for folks and families with Usher syndrome, I have also invited a few other folks who I believe may need this information about Braille.

All right? First, let me check… Everybody okay? Are you all following your interpreters? All right. Okay, so…

So, Usher syndrome is the most common genetic cause of combined hearing loss and vision loss. All right. However, there's a huge spectrum of vision loss and hearing loss. Everybody's progression is different. Even among siblings. It can be very different. Now, when the vision loss Starts to affect people, a lot of times they feel like, okay, I really need to… I'm not sure how long my vision will last, or do I need to learn Braille? And a lot of times, there is this panic mode. And we would like to avoid that. A lot of folks feel like learning braille is a little bit daunting. But it can be daunting if it's already in an urgent need. So, we are hoping that we can learn Braille early on, so that it is more fun and relaxed.

I am a parent of a child with Usher syndrome. When he was around 8 years old, I started to teach him, and also my other child, I started to teach them braille in a fun way. I actually took Legos. And I made this Legos, I don't… I don't think you can see them well. But, with their vision [still good]. And, you know, kids love Legos. It's… it's a way for me to try to teach them braille, and also to try to teach myself braille. However, I quickly forgot. What are these dots? What is this particular pattern?

And it was only recently when I got a book from Dr. Namita Jacob, The Sight Reading Braille Alphabet book, that I realized, like whatever approach they have in this book. I'm able to retain the patterns longer. Of course, after a few more days, months, if I don't practice, of course, I will forget. But I know that if I want to review it, I can always take a look at this book. And the information is, you know, what I call bite-sized information. Little at that time, in a fun way.

And when I got this book, my son immediately looked at it like, ooh, this looks like fun! Right? So, with that I had asked Dr. Namita, is there somebody you would recommend who can tell us more about Braille, and answer our questions. How can we learn braille in a fun way? Even if it's, you know, an introduction to Braille, how can we learn it in a fun way?

So, we have with us Teresa Anthony from Chetania Trust. She is the lead… I forgot how to introduce you ... Lead Illustrator and Designer of Accessible and Inclusive Books at. Chetana Trust. But I will hand it over to her to introduce herself in a better way.

[Teresa speaking]

Yeah. You guys can hear me, right? Yes?

[Interpreter speaking] We'll just switch the integrators now.

[Teresa speaking] Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Hi, everyone. My name is Teresa Anthony, and I'm from Chetana Trust. My sign name is the letter T against my smile. Yeah? That's my sign name.

So, I am a Lead Inclusive Designer at Chetana Trust. And part of what we do is we work with this very incredible Organization called SEDB, which is the Society for the Empowerment of the DeafBlind in India. It's a Society for the Empowerment of the DeafBlind in India.

So, what we do, in partnership with SEDB, is we help facilitate them to conduct a National Conference for the DeafBlind in India. And this year, we were very thrilled to see around 40… over 40 DeafBlind participants come together to be part of this conference. So, one of the things that we saw when we hang out with all of these participants was the people who came with them - deaf access providers or their support persons - they really wanted to learn Braille from us. And we thought that, wow, this is such a wonderful way for them to first learn Braille. And then to be able to teach their deafblind child, or husband, or wife Braille. And so, unless we, as access providers, learn first, it doesn't… it's… it makes the experience more daunting.

So we sat together, and we developed this book called Braille for Sighted Readers where we teach in this little book, by the end of the whole book, you learn Braille, to sight-read braille in a really fun way. There are a whole bunch of exercises that you can do. There are a whole bunch of little word puzzles. Everything in a stress-free manner that, by the end, you have had loads of fun but you have also learned braille.

So this book is specifically for the sighted families and friends who want to support their children or their partners or their friends who are deafblind, or become… starting to lose vision. And this is the main reason why we came up with the book. And I'd actually like to take a minute to show you what the book looks like. I'm just going to share my screen.

Are you able to see my screen? No?

Okay, this is very sad, because it looks like my screen has been, I'm not able… I'm going to share my screen. Geri, if you have the book with you, could you… pin yourself to the screen and flip through it.

Yeah, so maybe you can support me through this, because for some reason, Zoom's not allowing me to share my screen.

[Geri speaking] All right. Let me spotlight myself. I don't know how many people are now spotlighted.

[Teresa speaking] Okay, so this little book that Geri's holding is the sight-reading book for learning Braille alphabets. Geri, can you hold it a little back? Yeah, so if you open the first couple of pages.

It takes you to the first page where you learn to sight-read the first five alphabets, which is A, B, C, D, and E. You are then asked to practice. In that, in the given cells below, and Geri, can you flip through the rest of the pages? Right, and what we do is, instead of having to sight-read endless letters, what we do is we incorporate these little fun activities, which is find a word, and you have to find all these words that you have… all these letters that you have learned before. You have to look at it, and circle it and find it in this word puzzle.

Similarly, can you flip through? Yeah, similarly, we have additional exercises where you can find missing letters that will form a word. So you have to pick. For example, the first one has A, blank, and the letter D. So what could it be? Maybe it can be an N that comes over there, but now you have to think, yeah, that makes sense. It's the letter… it's the word AND, but now you have to find the letter N in Braille.

So it's through these little fun activities that you can learn Braille really quickly. Okay, and we do have a couple of pages where you can color in. Certain letters, and that's how the whole book is laid out. By the end of, yeah, over here, that Geri's showing you, this beautiful picture of this girl sitting under a tree. And you have to use the key at the site that tells you what a real letter needs to be colored in.

So, it's in these just really fun, small little whales, you can… truly learn Braille by the end of the whole book. By the end of the book, you are actually reading a simple story, and you are also able to write your own name in Braille. And write your own address in Braille. Because you've learned all the letters. We also do incorporate a few fun… a few punctuations to get you started.

So, this is mainly… yeah, exactly. This is the page where she talks about, if you're curious about punctuations, here are the punctuations, along with how simple sentences where you can spot the punctuations. So, this is a really simple starter book to learn Braille. It's very easy.

It is for any sighted parent, any sighted child, anybody who wants to learn. It's done in black and white to hopefully also allow for people with low vision to be able to easily capture it. But this is mainly meant for the sighted families and individuals who want to learn.

Beyond this, I'm sure the next question is going to be, okay, so the parent knows it. But what… how do we then teach Braille? So, for that, we are now coming up with the next level, which is somewhat similar to what we have done, this early Braille Reader for sighted partners. But we have another one that'll come up which allows… which is mainly for a person who's losing vision. It is for someone who is learning Braille, so it will actually have braille on it. This is something that we're currently developing, but it'll be done in the same sort of fashion.

One of our audience members is named Sunil. He's actually here with us today. He had come to our office and learned to braille with us. And he learned it in the same way, which is doing fun activities. And not having braille being a very horrible, stressful thing to learn. But we try to develop it in a very fun way, where he experiences… experiences that… positive, positivity. Like, you… he… as soon as he could read a couple of words, It's… it's great, because you've started off with just a few letters, but you're already able to read words very quickly. So, it's… having these positive experiences while reading Braille that helped the whole situation be a lot calmer.

So this is something we are coming up with as a sequel to this book. So that will be coming up soon.

So this is… at Chetana, what we do is we develop these resources that are required for any person with a disability who has a certain need. We… brainstorm, and we come up with a way to fill that gap. This is one of the gaps that we saw. And so we developed this book for the sighted readers to learn Braille.

These books are available. If it's on, maybe Geri can share a link to the group also, if they want to get it. But, this book is available for purchase as well. So, anyone who wants can reach out to us, for any parent or anyone who requires additional help.

Beyond this, they can always contact us. And we will get in touch with them, and help figure out a way in which their child or they can learn Braille and move forward with it.

[Geri speaking]

This is Geri. My next question is, so… After reading this book, actually, how long usually does it take a person to learn Braille? And the other thing also with this book, one suggestion here was to use either beads or buttons. And there's also coloring. So, usually how long, how long should one practice? Depending on, I guess, the need. As well as, after this book. if there is a need right now to further the learning of Braille, and if your other book, the next in the series, is not yet available, what can that person do?

[Teresa speaking]

Okay, so, you're talking specifically for a person who's losing vision, or are you talking about their sighted partners who are using the book?

[Geri speaking] So, this is actually for both. One is the parents, as well as, somebody who is, slowly losing their vision.

[Teresa speaking] Okay. So, okay, sorry, Teresa here. I think I'll answer for the first part. So for a sighted individual, it's truly subjective. I personally, drawing on my own experience, it took me an afternoon, I'd say about one and a half hours to learn Braille. But it was… it did require me to constantly practice. Practice in the sense I actually physically brailled books. I brailled sentences. Right? So I was doing it using a brailler.

But I do have friends who have learned braille quite… to read quite fluently, by simply having endless Braille cells printed out, and they would color it in. They would color in sentences, color in words, and they would learn it that way.

There was one colleague of mine who learned Braille. I was a more visual person. For me, I just required to color things in. But she required to use physical buttons. And create the braille cell. And add on or remove buttons, and remove beads to create each alphabet. It's by physically placing things into on a page that she was able to conceptualize the pattern in her head, and keep moving. This is for a sighted partner.

For a person who's losing vision, who is blind and is learning braille. I don't think there's a very straightforward answer in terms of how much time they will take to learn. But there is a thing to do prior to that, which is not introduce it as a book straightforward, but to do simple, fun things, learn braille through, maybe, games. Right? Have, like, how you're doing in this book, where you have little missing spellings. And all of that. There are certain things you can do within a gamified manner to learn Braille in a more positive way.

Doing simple things after you introduce an alphabet to a child right now. Suppose our book hasn't come out, and you are starting this off right away. There are certain things you can do. If you teach the alphabets straight away, and maybe start by brailling the title of a book, of a board book. So allowing them to start reading those few sentences or few lines, and as the child grows older, to label more things around. Maybe it can be the door of their room with their name on it. Maybe it can be… toys, labeled toys with Braille. Start making those experiences more positive, in the sense that it's quick, and they feel that excitement of having figured that out really quickly. Okay? So, it's not always about saying, okay, A, B, C, D, E, but more so about making that experience so much more satisfying and happy, and having that constant reinforcement throughout the house and throughout their various experiences that allow them to quickly grasp braille and never never forget it, because it's always around them.

I remember when I was learning Braille, Namita who had taught me, she's the director of our Chetana Trust. She had taught me Braille and something that she always made me do was to pickup storybook titles.

Sorry, should I pause for the interpreters? Yeah, so sorry, sorry.

Yeah? Okay. So something, Namita had… Yeah, something Nomita had made me do. This is her name sign, an N, with her hair going down, if that helps anybody. Um, something that helps… helped me was she would make me go through sets of books, pick out books, and read the first line of the title of the book. And so that really helped me constantly remember the letters.

So these are simple things you can do, practical things you can do around on a daily basis that allow a child to keep learning braille.

So, yeah, there's no time frame, but it's a continued process.

[Geri speaking] This is Geri. You talked about a brailler.

[Teresa speaking] Yes.

[Geri speaking] So, my next question is when somebody is learning, is there a particular equipment that somebody needs to buy, or if we are just, for example, labeling things at home, can I use something like the Bindis, or, you know, some stickers? Elevator stickers that will stick to whatever the surface long enough. What's your suggestion?

[Teresa speaking] Yeah. So, Teresa here. For reading Braille, obviously, we don't require any .... For reading braille. you need Brailled things. So, I guess that answers itself.

To write Braille, A child would first learn alphabets. What we often do is, well, we introduced the alphabets first by reading the alphabets.

And bindi's would fall… would work, but mostly fall under, uh… trying to identify certain things. So I guess we just need to back up a little.

From identifying braille alphabets. And truly understand what comes before learning the alphabets, which is learning pre-braille skills. What are certain things a child needs for their fingers to to totally get braille. And for that, it is through being able to identify things with their fingers. That's one.

And, being able to have develop a tactile memory.

So, what we do right now, which is interesting that you brought that up, because what we are developing now is something called a pre-braille kit. And it focuses mainly on pre-braille skills, which is how to trace a line, how to scan a page, how to move seamlessly from line to line to line. And we do this through games and stories.

So, I'd say, prior to this, we need to acknowledge that there is this being able to develop these Braille skills first. Beyond that, there are certain things you can do.

What's typically known is that there is a brailler. It's a little too expensive, but there is a slate and stylus.

This slate and stylus is the most accessible. The only problem is, you are brailling in a mirror image. Now, with that mirror image, it's really hard for them to start. So if you learn that the letter A is Dot 1, and when you're using a slate and stylus, you now have to remember that it's Dot 5, so that when you turn the page, it becomes Dot 1.

Now, that's a whole different level of mental gymnastics anyone has to do, and as someone just starting to learn braille, that's really hard.

There are certain apps that we have found that allow 6 keys to become those six dots, the six cell dots. Right? The six dots of a braille cell, sorry. So, these apps also are a great way to to work on those writing skills. That's another.

But so far, this is what we have.

Yeah. So I guess there's a range, it just depends on how you would like to begin.

[Geri speaking] This is Geri. By the way, if others have questions, I'm the only one asking questions. So, if others have questions, please speak up.

[Interpreter speaking] Divya has a question. This is Divya, yes, I have a question. I just wanted to know… Sorry, just a moment.

I just kind of wanted to share my experience with using Braille, looking back, when I was about 7 or 8 years old. One thing that I really started enjoyed starting to learn was how to make cupcakes. We would use a cupcake tin with different color balls. And I would play with those, and that really, really helped me learn the pre-braille skills of, you know, being able to put the cup or the balls in the little muffin tin spaces.

And luckily, you know, we didn't have the technology that you all have now, and children have now, growing up learning braille, but, using the cupcake tin to help me practice my pre-brail skills was very helpful. And, I noticed that, you know, once you start learning the alphabet and braille, it's really this kind of, like, the same concept as learning sign to fingerspell, um, the alphabet and sign. It's a very similar concept, you know, just like you learn how to write your letters, you kind of learn how to write them in the air, and then you learn how to write them on paper. It's definitely a process. And you have to start with the basics first, in a non-stressful situation. It's gotta be really fun, you know, you can't stress on children to be like, you have to learn this, you know. It's… you really do need to make it fun in order to make it a positive learning experience for children. And, we also used… I'm picking up a little device here. It's like a… almost like a typewriter machine. Yes, a brailler machine that looks like a typewriter. I use the brailler machine, and I would know what the positions were for 1, 2, 3, and 4, 5, 6, and I'd figure out how to match them. with the buttons that were on the device. And just practicing that over and over again, over time, really helped build those pre-braille skills as well. And, you know, I would just do a little bit at a time, each and every day, not huge chunks of time, but it was super important to help me develop the mental skills, as well as the memory skills to be able to read Braille in the future. And then later on, I got a different piece of technology. It's a little braille reader, and that, a braille display, thank you, that connects to any kind of Bluetooth technologies, so… That's nice to use, but like I said, it's really important to take those baby steps. And start off with the basics to become an expert braille reader. [Geri speaking] This is Geri. Divya, thank you for sharing that experience with us. It's really interesting, all those, you know, cupcake tin. That gives me an idea. Any kind of thing related to food, the kids would love to do that. [Teresa speaking] Yeah, I just want to add my… Teresa here. I just want to add that, what we often do, or what I know that Namita and other people do with children is they take an egg carton that has 6 holes. And they use that as well while teaching Braille. So, each of the egg carton holes, since there are six, it becomes the braille cell, and they use that as well, while you know, developing pre-braille skills, and sometimes when we do workhops with sighted individuals who want to learn Braille, we do often say that, hey, you know, if you have this egg carton that this 6-egg carton that allows you to mimic a braille cell, that's a really great start, because you physically have something in front of you to work with. And I also just want to say that What Divya said was so right, having a cupcake, making cupcakes to learn pre-braille skills is really fun. And that's… and what the essence of what she's saying, which is building a positive attitude to learn braille. That is key. And for a child, be it a child, an adult, anyone who's learning braille, creating this positive, fun, Braille is this super cool thing, right? Like, to be able to create that atmosphere is what we really need to do. And what we're really hoping that these things, that these resources that we're also trying to develop will help people. you know, change that attitude. [Geri speaking] This is Geri. My other question is, you had talked about pre-Braille skills. And… You know, the braille dots are really small. So… how… so, they say that for children, the fingers are more sensitive compared to adults. How do we, you know, as adults, trying to learn this, how do we, kind of sensitize our hands or something like that, so that we developed that tactile feel. So I guess you close your eyes or something, and… I remember as a child. There are tactile books. Okay, this is the rough surface, this is, you know, you trace this line, this is a smooth surface. Is there something like that that people can try to kind of, like, sensitize their fingers? [Teresa speaking] Mm-hmm. Yeah, so, I don't know if I'm the best person to answer this, because by sharing, I'm not an educator, but I can tell you what we have done, which is, if there's a certain skill that we want to work on... Oh, sorry, everyone, this is Teresa speaking. I completely missed that. If there's a certain skill we want to work on, suppose it is, suppose it's being a… for a child to be able to… or an adult, to be able to identify textures, we first start with the very basic ones. Smooth. Rough. Right? And we make a texture game out of it. So, it's a little memory game. You get to, you have flat cards, and on one side of the card is a texture. It's either rough or smooth. You play it along with a friend, or you play it by yourself even, it's super fun. You have all these cards laid out, and you have to form pairs. So, you pick one card up, feel it, if it's smooth. You try again, pick another card. If you get a smooth one, then you get to keep both. And the aim is to clear out your entire, deck of cards. Right? So that's one way of playing it. Yes. [Interpreter speaking] Sorry, Teresa, can we take a moment to switch interpreters? Yes, please go ahead. [Teresa speaking] Yeah, so, uh, and as we… so right now, we've identified rough and smooth. And as we keep going, we start introducing new textures that are either similar. And so you're starting to identify rough. From not so rough. Or smooth from not so smooth. And your, you know, that we try to make them pay attention to those details. So a lot of our games will often have that gradation of textures that allow them to start building that either that vocabulary of what different textures can feel like, or also to start having them, through a fun game, start noticing these slight differences in textures. So that's one. So, I guess through, again, through… depending on a goal you're working on, or, some skill that you're trying to develop, it can be done through very fun ways, like how Divya said, even by baking cupcakes. So, yeah, that is what we'd do. [Geri speaking] This is Geri. Divya? Yes, Divya has a question. [Interpreter speaking for Divya] This is Divya speaking. With my experience as a teacher for communication skills at the Learning Center, I've taught different DeafBlind individual, adult individuals. And they have quite a variety of needs as far as braille is concerned. Some really struggle with working with paper. Some have other issues and other preferences. Some prefer really thick braille dots. And so you have to match each individual's needs. So, sometimes it really depends on the person's disability. And what's going on with their hands, possibly they don't have the sensitivity to be able to feel the braille dots, and that becomes very frustrating. So that you have to use a variety of ways. Myself as an instructor, what I have done Is just kind of come up with different ways to match and accommodate each person's needs. There are different ways to use, perhaps, very big dots for people who struggle with the very… with the small standard braille dots. Or we might come up with other things, like maybe balls, like soccer balls. So that they can feel the positioning. And they know that that matches, for example, the letter A, or the number 1. And they can feel where that is in relation to other balls. And that works pretty well, if they're not… if some people are able to feel the small dots. And we… so we just really have a variety of different ways that we can choose to work with those individuals. And I really was impressed with that. People with physical disabilities have some more serious challenges. They might need some… a specific type of braille. Like, for example, the refreshable braille display might not be great for them. Because that's kind of a struggle with being able to feel those dots. So they might need something that's got a much stronger pin in the braille display because their nerve system is not able to feel those smaller, softer pins. And those are some things that have not yet really been developed. We've not had enough advocacy for those types of technology just yet for people with serious physical and nerve damage. And also, as an instructor, I have had some people who've had a really easy time. But then trying to use the more advanced books, like, for example, going to Disney, or… you know, Goldilocks and the Three Bears, Disney Stories are Goldilocks and the Three Bears children's books. When we compare what they're doing with following what's in the story and brailleing those books, That helps… bring those books, if we can help bring those books into Braille for DeafBlind individuals to be able to read them, because not everyone has the same exact needs. There's quite a variety and a diversity of needs for adults, as well as for children. They just need to have the opportunity to braille… to learn braille, and senior citizens, of course, also need that opportunity. They will have a harder time learning braille without practicing every day. They will have to practice those things over and over again, to help them memorize the braille system, you know, if they don't practice, they will forget what the individual cells are. It's like, gosh, you know, I forgot, I need a K, but I forgot what that letter is. And of course, it's dots 1 and 3. But they'll have to practice that over and over again to remember. And they'll say, oh yeah, right, right, right, right, right. So it's really… it's hard to, you know, sometimes it can be harder for them to have a positive experience, because they… forget more quickly. But then again, we have so many different things that we can use to learn Braille with that variety of needs and disabilities. And we have to have people who are willing to learn together. [Teresa speaking] Mm-hmm. Teresa here. I'd just like to pop in and say, yeah, to what… to what Divya said, having that constant experience of, you know, constantly practicing and having ways to remember these combinations of different dots to create letters, unless you practice, it's not going to be effective. One of the things that we do in Chetana is we run an accessible reading materials library where we have, for young readers, we have Brailed storybooks. These are really fun, and they have a lot of tactile work. [Interpreter speaking] Excuse me, excuse me, Teresa, Sunil is waving. Sunil is waving. Do we want to Sunil to be spotlighted? [Teresa speakng] Yeah, sure, yeah. [Interpreting speaking for Sunil] Yeah. Sunil also wants to share something. He has to leave now. But thank you so much for having me, and thank you, Teresa, for teaching me all about the Braille. It's been so many years that I have I've been learning, and it's been a very exciting journey. And I was losing my vision when I started, right? Like It was hard. I… you're saying, I mean, I was the suffering when I was practicing. Yeah, it took me some time. It took me a lot of years… And… and I was also old, right? It was not the appropriate age to learn this. As I was aging and learning Braille. I just wanted to appreciate you while going through this Usher's… usher's journey. You being a teacher, and, you know, achieve that trust, giving me that support. Yeah, bless you, and thank you for all that you've done. And now I have something urgent, and I'll have to leave now, so just wanted to interrupt and see bye. [Geri speaking] This is Geri. Thank you! [Interpreter speaking for Sunil] Geri, also, thank you, and… and also thank you to Saurav. Bye bye. [Geri speaking] This is Geri. Bye Sunil. [Interpreter speaking for Sunil] Divya, thank you Divya! [Teresa speaking] Yeah, so back to Teresa again over here. Um, I really did forget what I was saying, but… but, I guess the essence of it is that, we do have an online library right now. That is completely free. It's an accessible library that's free for anybody. And we allow for anyone who wants that storybook, they can click a little button that says download as PDF, and print the book. And you have the physical book with you, and you just have to attach the braille on it. So this is another way in which we try to help, you know, retain these braille skills as you keep going. So being able to have this resource to these… right now, I think we have around 27 storybooks, so being able to have that might also help anyone who wants to download the story, braille it, and have it with them in their home, or in their libraries. [Geri speaking] Oh, this is Geri. When you say… sorry, I don't have any experience using a brailler. So when you say you can print it in PDF and then attach it to a brailler? Okay, so the brailler… I didn't know that the brailler can do that. So, it would… oh, no, no, I mean… and then it would print! Sorry! I don't have an idea what a brailler does! [Teresa speaking] Okay, Teresa here, let me clarify. A brailler is what Divya showed, is a typewriter that allows you to produce braille in print. So you can read Braille. You can print on these transparent sticker sheets that you can then cut, peel off and stick on a page, so it doesn't affect anyone's vision, but it… you can feel the braille throughout all the pages. So, if there's anyone who wants braille, this is a way in which you can do it. You can, at least in Chennai, I know if there's any... Chennai, that's in India, that's where I am from. If there's anyone who wants something produced in Braille, there are places where they can go to, and ask for that to be produced in Braille. There are also people like me who would love to do this for anyone who wants help, so yeah, so what we're trying to say is that a brailler doesn't just produce the braille. If it's a braille typewriter, you have to braille it, peel it, and stick it on your book. There is a Braille printer wherein you feed in the text. It'll translate to braille and print directly on its own. That's a braille printer, that's a completely separate machine. That's also used for a lot of textbooks. A lot of the, … a lot of braille magazines and those kinds of productions. That's a Braille printer. But for a individual to use, it's what Divya said, which is either a brailler, like a typewriter, the slate and stylus, Or, since our books are accessible, she can use her braille reader, her Orbit, her refreshable display. And she can read it digitally, because they're all available as EPUB files as well. [Geri speaking] This is Geri. Thanks for the clarification. [Teresa speaking] No, no problem. [Geri speaking] Complete novice. Alright, any other questions from the others? So, for somebody who is learning braille, going through some of these books for practice. And then later on, maybe get a stylus and pen, or brailler also. Approximately how much is a brailler? Or… is there a… [Teresa speaking] I am not too sure. Maybe Divya would be a better person to answer that question. [Geri speaking] This is Geri. Divya is in Florida. So… I don't know how much in India. [Interpreter speaking for Divya] This is Divya speaking. Oof, it is expensive. This one that I have costs… let me think… it's… first of all, it's heavy. It's really heavy. … trying to think, in America, it costs… around $4,000 or $5,000, I think? But in India, I don't know how much it would be in rupees. [Teresa speaking] Yeah, I'm not too sure. My Teresa here. My memory was that it was around, between 60,000, 50,000, around that range, is what my memory is. But this is a Perkins brailler, I'm not entirely sure. [Interpreter speaking] Teresa, sorry, 15,000 or 50,000? [Teresa speaking] 5 - 0. I'm not entirely sure, please do not quote me on this. But this is information that's easily available online. If anyone wants to buy it, I'm sure there are places to go. [Geri speaking] This is Geri. I'm just trying to think, for somebody who's beginning, what are their options, if they want to label things at home? [Interpreter speaking] This is the interpreter speaking. We're gonna pause for a moment to switch interpreters. [Teresa speaking] Yeah. Teresa here. The question was what is the… what is the next option, right? If a brailler is too expensive, and someone who is blind, wants to label something, what is their best option? That, unfortunately, right now, is the slate and stylus. Slate and stylus, so what we'd recommend is first learning to read Braille. And then understanding this flip for the slate and stylus, which you need to do to write. [Geri speaking] This is Geri. Now I understand where that flip came from. All right. I… this is Geri. Go ahead, Divya. [Interpreter speaking for Divya] This is Divya speaking. I have worked with the slate and slylus in the past, and you know, you remember the old-fashioned one where you have to actually flip it over… And write the opposite direction, and so it's very hard to remember that, and to keep that in mind as you're writing. You have to actually write left to right. And it's… It's just so, so interesting. It's… everything is opposite, and then you flip it back over. And you can read it in braille. And, you know, that takes a ton of practice, and let me tell you, I've made my mistakes trying to use that stylus, so… It takes a lot of practice, but it's doable. It's just you have to remember the flipping. It's always flipped. Everything is flipped. And then after it's written, you flip it back over, and you can read in regular braille, so… It's not an easy process, it definitely takes some time to learn. It was really difficult for me. But that's why I love this device. Kind of resolves all that frustration, so… I tried the stylus for about a year, and now I have the brailler, and uh… There… I actually got it from Blind Services. They actually actually paid for that for me. I didn't have to pay for it out of pocket, so that was really nice. [Geri speaking] This is Geri. I need to check if… I believe there are government programs (in India) that support the purchase of Braille machines for education. I need to take a look at that. The other thing is, you mentioned also that for students, there are certain organizations that will produce books in braille. So, I'll also take a look at that. All right. I'm out of questions. Is there any other questions from folks? [Teresa speaking] If there aren't any questions, Teresa here, if there aren't any questions, I think I'd just like to end my bit by saying Braille, regardless of when it is taught, if it is taught in a fun way, bring the fun back into teaching Braille, and in the ways in which it's done, I feel like it'll be an easier and more enjoyable process. [Geri speaking] This is Geri. I completely agree with that. When I showed my son, I wanted to introduce him to Braille, he was very intrigued by it. And now, after how many years, he still looks at, you know, Legos in a different way. And I actually have this, kind of like, keychain that you can turn around and have braille letters, something like that. So, he's… he still plays with it. He doesn't remember the letters. But at least there's that awareness of, of, what is braille and, you know. That his fingers being sensitive to the dots. But if there are no other questions, I would like to thank Teresa for sharing her Saturday night with us. And, and please thank Namita also for suggesting you to us. [Teresa speaking] Teresa here. Thank you, everyone. Thank you, Geri, for organizing this and allowing us to be part of it. Thank you. And to all the interpreters, thank you so much. I know I didn't give many pauses, but thank you. [Interpreter speaking for Divya] Thank you, Geri. Divya says thank you as well. [Geri speaking] All right, so at this point, by the way, I will share the link to Chetana Trust, where you can order these books. Now, I am going to stop the recording right now. We are going to go on our part two of this meeting. Teresa, you can also log out now. Thank you for your time. Bye! So, let me switch off the recorder.